Ferrari is cheating!! (again!) - Opinion

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K-D
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Post by K-D » Fri May 06, 2005 9:24 pm

sgd wrote:I just canno belive it!!!!!

it's you who need to come back to earth!!!!

I have NEVER talked about breaking rules!!!

I SAID: (and PLESAE READ THIS!!!!)

"who said it is my opinion that ferrari-cheaters do ilimited times more test for they tyres, mechanical parts, aerodinamics, set-ups, ... when the rest of the teams have limited their test????
is sad K-D but it is a FACT!!!!!!!!!!!
and is absolutely clear that from a sportive point of view (for drivers and fans, etc...) is no more and no less then CHEAT!!!!!!!"

where do you see i'm talking about breaking rules???????
I talk about CHEATERS who, btw manipulate and control the rules-maker body (FIA)
You strated with this:
sgd wrote:Note that some of their cheats may NOT be illigal, but still CHEAT!!

1.The whole team works only in ONE driver and the second one is NOT allowed to win if this affects the FIRST driver.

2.This season ferari will be barking a test-limiting agreement which signed 100% of their competitors.

3.Ferrari is receiving more money from F1 then any other team.

4.Ferrari preferencial treatment by F1... ferarri ideas becoming rules...

5.....

Do you know more?

so... they don't just cheat, but cheat*chat*cheat*chat (4!!)!! (at least)
And then went from there.

8)
K-D

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Post by sgd » Fri May 06, 2005 9:26 pm

K-D wrote:
sgd wrote:I just canno belive it!!!!!

it's you who need to come back to earth!!!!

I have NEVER talked about breaking rules!!!

I SAID: (and PLESAE READ THIS!!!!)

"who said it is my opinion that ferrari-cheaters do ilimited times more test for they tyres, mechanical parts, aerodinamics, set-ups, ... when the rest of the teams have limited their test????
is sad K-D but it is a FACT!!!!!!!!!!!
and is absolutely clear that from a sportive point of view (for drivers and fans, etc...) is no more and no less then CHEAT!!!!!!!"

where do you see i'm talking about breaking rules???????
I talk about CHEATERS who, btw manipulate and control the rules-maker body (FIA)
You strated with this:
sgd wrote:Note that some of their cheats may NOT be illigal, but still CHEAT!!

1.The whole team works only in ONE driver and the second one is NOT allowed to win if this affects the FIRST driver.

2.This season ferari will be barking a test-limiting agreement which signed 100% of their competitors.

3.Ferrari is receiving more money from F1 then any other team.

4.Ferrari preferencial treatment by F1... ferarri ideas becoming rules...

5.....

Do you know more?

so... they don't just cheat, but cheat*chat*cheat*chat (4!!)!! (at least)
And then went from there.

8)
K-D wrote:It is not, and can not be cheating that ferrari is testing more than the other teams, as there are no rules to break.

Please tell me where i talked about breaking rules, please!!!!!!!

btw, now i'n talking about poinr No4. only...

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Post by K-D » Fri May 06, 2005 10:01 pm

sgd wrote:
K-D wrote:
sgd wrote:I just canno belive it!!!!!

it's you who need to come back to earth!!!!

I have NEVER talked about breaking rules!!!

I SAID: (and PLESAE READ THIS!!!!)

"who said it is my opinion that ferrari-cheaters do ilimited times more test for they tyres, mechanical parts, aerodinamics, set-ups, ... when the rest of the teams have limited their test????
is sad K-D but it is a FACT!!!!!!!!!!!
and is absolutely clear that from a sportive point of view (for drivers and fans, etc...) is no more and no less then CHEAT!!!!!!!"

where do you see i'm talking about breaking rules???????
I talk about CHEATERS who, btw manipulate and control the rules-maker body (FIA)
You strated with this:
sgd wrote:Note that some of their cheats may NOT be illigal, but still CHEAT!!

1.The whole team works only in ONE driver and the second one is NOT allowed to win if this affects the FIRST driver.

2.This season ferari will be barking a test-limiting agreement which signed 100% of their competitors.

3.Ferrari is receiving more money from F1 then any other team.

4.Ferrari preferencial treatment by F1... ferarri ideas becoming rules...

5.....

Do you know more?

so... they don't just cheat, but cheat*chat*cheat*chat (4!!)!! (at least)
And then went from there.

8)
K-D wrote:It is not, and can not be cheating that ferrari is testing more than the other teams, as there are no rules to break.

Please tell me where i talked about breaking rules, please!!!!!!!

btw, now i'n talking about poinr No4. only...
Posting rules forbid me for replying.

8)
K-D

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Post by sgd » Fri May 06, 2005 10:07 pm

wellcome back to earth!

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Post by Ed » Sat May 07, 2005 1:39 pm

F1greyhound wrote:Could anybody rename this topic, I mean isnt it a bunch of random thoughts plus SGDs conspiracy theory??

I do not think a topic may be substantially insultant against anyone, team or driver...

CHEERS!
You have a point about a topic not being substantially insultant against anyone. The topic name now has Opinion added at the end of it to reflect an opinion rather than being thought of as a fact.
We also continuosly monitor what is being posted. We attempt to discourage posters from posting insulting comments. If we have missed any please PM me and we'll look at it.

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Post by Kapel » Sat May 07, 2005 4:44 pm

Thanks Ed :up: for adding the word "Opinion" otherwise sgd would keep sounding his Opinion posing as facts :wink:

:cheers:
An F1 Idiot!!!

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Post by F1greyhound » Thu May 12, 2005 10:33 pm

Thanks
YOURS IN SPORT

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Ferrari Cheating again!! ...

Post by sgd » Mon Jun 27, 2005 8:56 am

This is from ITV's website:
(see full article here: http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=33243 )
...The Autosport-Atlas website reports that the Maranello team has been using special wheel-heating boxes (rather than regular tyre blankets) in a bid to gain qualifying pace at recent grands prix.

Ferrari has apparently been using these devices since the Monaco Grand Prix after struggling in single-lap qualifying at the early-season races – a weakness that was generally attributed to an inability to generate enough heat in its Bridgestone tyres.

...

The curved metal boxes work by heating the wheel rim as well as the tyre, but the inside casing is understood to consist of the same electrical heating equipment used in conventional tyre blankets.

As a result, the FIA is believed to be satisfied that the devices do not contravene Article 75F of Formula 1’s Sporting Regulations, which stipulates that, “The only permitted type of tyre heating devices are blankets which use resistive heating elements.”
However, some rival teams believe that the boxes more than stretch the definition of ‘blankets’ and instead constitute a kind of ‘tyre oven’, which is clearly outside the regulations.

One leading engineer told Autosport-Atlas, “If Ferrari is allowed to use this system then it seems strange, because it is clear that you can only use a blanket to heat the tyre and not a metal box.”

The key advantage of using a metal box is that it heats up the tyre more uniformly over the entire rubber surface as opposed to just the contact patch.
:evil: :evil: :evil:
Cheeeaters....Cheateeers.....
Still some say that ferrari do not cheat... that's quite innocent, knowing todt...
=============================
the only way they can win in 2005 is in a race vs Jordan and Minardi!...
They understood that they have to cheat as usually if they want to Qualify better then 10... that is Ferrari!


"It's not Ferrari's problem"
Jean Todt, USGP 2005.

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Re: Ferrari Cheating again!! ...

Post by Julian Mayo » Mon Jun 27, 2005 9:53 am

sgd wrote:This is from ITV's website:
(see full article here: http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=33243 )
...The Autosport-Atlas website reports that the Maranello team has been using special wheel-heating boxes (rather than regular tyre blankets) in a bid to gain qualifying pace at recent grands prix.

Ferrari has apparently been using these devices since the Monaco Grand Prix after struggling in single-lap qualifying at the early-season races ? a weakness that was generally attributed to an inability to generate enough heat in its Bridgestone tyres.

...

The curved metal boxes work by heating the wheel rim as well as the tyre, but the inside casing is understood to consist of the same electrical heating equipment used in conventional tyre blankets.

As a result, the FIA is believed to be satisfied that the devices do not contravene Article 75F of Formula 1?s Sporting Regulations, which stipulates that, ?The only permitted type of tyre heating devices are blankets which use resistive heating elements.?
However, some rival teams believe that the boxes more than stretch the definition of ?blankets? and instead constitute a kind of ?tyre oven?, which is clearly outside the regulations.

One leading engineer told Autosport-Atlas, ?If Ferrari is allowed to use this system then it seems strange, because it is clear that you can only use a blanket to heat the tyre and not a metal box.?

The key advantage of using a metal box is that it heats up the tyre more uniformly over the entire rubber surface as opposed to just the contact patch.
:evil: :evil: :evil:
Cheeeaters....Cheateeers.....
Still some say that ferrari do not cheat... that's quite innocent, knowing todt...
=============================
the only way they can win in 2005 is in a race vs Jordan and Minardi!...
They understood that they have to cheat as usually if they want to Qualify better then 10... that is Ferrari!


"It's not Ferrari's problem"
Jean Todt, USGP 2005.
:zzz:
The Mountain is a savage Mistress.

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Re: Ferrari Cheating again!! ...

Post by Kapel » Mon Jun 27, 2005 3:42 pm

sgd wrote:This is from ITV's website:
(see full article here: http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=33243 )
...The Autosport-Atlas website reports that the Maranello team has been using special wheel-heating boxes (rather than regular tyre blankets) in a bid to gain qualifying pace at recent grands prix.

Ferrari has apparently been using these devices since the Monaco Grand Prix after struggling in single-lap qualifying at the early-season races ? a weakness that was generally attributed to an inability to generate enough heat in its Bridgestone tyres.

...

The curved metal boxes work by heating the wheel rim as well as the tyre, but the inside casing is understood to consist of the same electrical heating equipment used in conventional tyre blankets.

As a result, the FIA is believed to be satisfied that the devices do not contravene Article 75F of Formula 1?s Sporting Regulations, which stipulates that, ?The only permitted type of tyre heating devices are blankets which use resistive heating elements.?
However, some rival teams believe that the boxes more than stretch the definition of ?blankets? and instead constitute a kind of ?tyre oven?, which is clearly outside the regulations.

One leading engineer told Autosport-Atlas, ?If Ferrari is allowed to use this system then it seems strange, because it is clear that you can only use a blanket to heat the tyre and not a metal box.?

The key advantage of using a metal box is that it heats up the tyre more uniformly over the entire rubber surface as opposed to just the contact patch.
:evil: :evil: :evil:
Cheeeaters....Cheateeers.....
Still some say that ferrari do not cheat... that's quite innocent, knowing todt...
=============================
the only way they can win in 2005 is in a race vs Jordan and Minardi!...
They understood that they have to cheat as usually if they want to Qualify better then 10... that is Ferrari!


"It's not Ferrari's problem"
Jean Todt, USGP 2005.
Only U sgd can come up with all this.Is this our paying job??? :evil: :lol:

When the FIA have cleared this,u obviously the GURU of technicalities thinks its cheating,y??? Ah because its a Ferrari!!!! :lol: :lol:
An F1 Idiot!!!

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Re: Ferrari Cheating again!! ...

Post by sgd » Tue Jun 28, 2005 6:48 am

Kapel wrote:When the FIA have cleared this,u obviously the GURU of technicalities thinks its cheating,y??? Ah because its a Ferrari!!!! :lol: :lol:
I'm not a Guru, that's why i cite the article from the ITV site...
from the Autosport-Atlas (they should had doen some research or/and have at least one expert, i guess) this is clear cheat...
you'd had your opinion but after reading the Autosport-Atlas + ITV article it's quite clear that ferrari is cheating.

--------
Julian is sleeping? it 'd be overdose of ice cream... ;) or he got used to ferrari cheating?
In fact it didn't suprised me neither, it's just funny to see how they only could cheat with that device in order to do better instead of better their package... I feel sorry for them.

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Re: Ferrari Cheating again!! ...

Post by Julian Mayo » Tue Jun 28, 2005 10:12 am

sgd wrote:
Kapel wrote:When the FIA have cleared this,u obviously the GURU of technicalities thinks its cheating,y??? Ah because its a Ferrari!!!! :lol: :lol:
I'm not a Guru, that's why i cite the article from the ITV site...
from the Autosport-Atlas (they should had doen some research or/and have at least one expert, i guess) this is clear cheat...
you'd had your opinion but after reading the Autosport-Atlas + ITV article it's quite clear that ferrari is cheating.

--------
Julian is sleeping? it 'd be overdose of ice cream... ;) or he got used to ferrari cheating?
In fact it didn't suprised me neither, it's just funny to see how they only could cheat with that device in order to do better instead of better their package... I feel sorry for them.

SGD, you cannot escape the fact that the device has been approved by the FIA, so it cannot be cheating! It also means the other teams can use it! Now, if you are suggesting that Ferrari can come up with something which gives them an advantage over other teams, and the FIA will automatically rubber stamp that thing, that is a different issue. But you need to back that up with solid, irrefutable fact. :lol:
The Mountain is a savage Mistress.

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Re: Ferrari Cheating again!! ...

Post by Kapel » Tue Jun 28, 2005 3:59 pm

sgd wrote:
Kapel wrote:When the FIA have cleared this,u obviously the GURU of technicalities thinks its cheating,y??? Ah because its a Ferrari!!!! :lol: :lol:
I'm not a Guru, that's why i cite the article from the ITV site...
from the Autosport-Atlas (they should had doen some research or/and have at least one expert, i guess) this is clear cheat...
you'd had your opinion but after reading the Autosport-Atlas + ITV article it's quite clear that ferrari is cheating.

In fact it didn't suprised me neither, it's just funny to see how they only could cheat with that device in order to do better instead of better their package... I feel sorry for them.
Read those articles mate.But nowhere did i see the word cheat.Its mentioned only in ur dictionary next to the word"Ferrari"

Its only ur opinion,cos they used it to perform better.Doesnt everyone use something different to enhance their performance in the race???When its approved by the FIA,I'm sorry,ur opinion doesnt stand a chance,even in the thread u created to satisfy ur grunt :lol: :lol:
An F1 Idiot!!!

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Post by Krazy-K » Fri Aug 12, 2005 11:50 pm

I agree with most of the people in here: You can't say that Ferrari is cheating or using something that is illegal. There is no evidence for that whatsoever. Ferrari in the far past has never been as successful as today. They have worked like crazy to get to where they are, and the accused underachiever Micheal Schumacher is arguably the best driver ever.

But what there is evidence for on the other hand is that Ferrari tends to follow its own interest and alot of times push the morals of the sport.
An example: Most of the time you will see the Bridgestone headman standing next to Jean Todt throughout the race or qualifying. This of course is understandable for Bridgestone cause they want to get their top team to win, and for ferrari very conveniant because they get to have a tire producer give them tailored-fitted tires. (Notice how Bridgestone is only represented in the top teams through Ferrari, Michelin dominating the rest). But again there's nothing wrong with that, no one says that you can't do that, and companies are just following their own interest, i bet Michelin would be doing the same if put in that position. As said their mechanics are mainly focusing on Micheals car, because that's where Ferrari believes they can win. Micheal on most occasions outdone Barrichello from the start. No one forbids concentrating on one car or using more resources for one or the other, and besides that fact hasn't been proven at all. And the Team-order rule only came in later on and since then, if they have let micheal come in before barrichello it was very subtle, not like in the past where it was quite outrageous at times, but they weren't cheating, simply following their own interest. Same thing recently in Indianapolis, people quote Jean todt saying: "This is not Ferrari's problem." Well it really isn't is it? If Michelin can't get the right tires, why should they care? And its true: Do you honestly think all of the other teams would not race simply because Bridgestone couldn't get the right tires? They'd say: This is not our problem.

But it's not just Ferrari that makes their image quite sour, but Micheal himself hasn't exactly made any friends with his moves in the past, slamming into Villeneuve or Damon Hill. Or on another occassion trying to win a race by going in to the pit lane for his stop and go penalty in the final lap, and inside crossing the finish line. Although he has apologized for these actions, it still remains very controversial.


You can blame Ferrari, i think, for poor sportsmanship at times, but you can't accuse them of cheating.

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Post by lemon_martini2 » Sat Aug 13, 2005 1:50 am

Ferrari's problem is that especially since Michael's been there,they've gained a reputation of pushing the rules to the limit or finding gray areas. When they do something that gets everyone up in arms and then says 'the rules don't exactly say you can't',it gets people annoyed.
And MS has gained a reputation as a controversial driver and each time something happens,Ferrari's perceived integrity drops a little.
So when something is found that isn't quite right,there's something in people's heads that immediately springs to mind they must be cheating whereas another team with no previous record they would be more likely to dismiss that as a one-off mistake.Mud sticks.
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