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Julian Mayo wrote: Renault reports that the increase in sales of cars in Spain since winning the Titles is 3:7% or double the increase in France and Germany

A clarification might be in order. Overall in Europe last year, Renault dropped by 4.1%. It increased its international share by 21%, which overall gives renault a 1.7% increase in total sales world wide.

Did some googling and you are right rah, they grew by 1.7% in 2005. Europe is a mature market so you don't expect significant growth there. From the report it seems they are holding their ground in many countries. The interesting bit it internationally and the growth is massive

Look at these figures:

Eastern Europe & Russia +50.5%
Latin America +11.8%
Asia Pacific +36.3%
Africa & Middle East +12.1%

Surely some of this growth can be contributed to the success in Formula 1

Anyway, the restructuring plans will be announced in February and we'll see how Renault F1 will be affected. I'd expect them to be put under a bit of pressure to try and get more sponsorship deals etc but pulling out won't even be on the agenda.

rah wrote:

Julian Mayo wrote: Renault reports that the increase in sales of cars in Spain since winning the Titles is 3:7% or double the increase in France and Germany

A clarification might be in order. Overall in Europe last year, Renault dropped by 4.1%. It increased its international share by 21%, which overall gives renault a 1.7% increase in total sales world wide.

Or less than the inflation rate

JayVee wrote:I'd expect them to be put under a bit of pressure to try and get more sponsorship deals etc but pulling out won't even be on the agenda.

You must have some great contacts.

JayVee wrote:Did some googling and you are right rah, they grew by 1.7% in 2005. Europe is a mature market so you don't expect significant growth there. From the report it seems they are holding their ground in many countries. The interesting bit it internationally and the growth is massive

Look at these figures:

Eastern Europe & Russia +50.5%
Latin America +11.8%
Asia Pacific +36.3%
Africa & Middle East +12.1%

Surely some of this growth can be contributed to the success in Formula 1

Anyway, the restructuring plans will be announced in February and we'll see how Renault F1 will be affected. I'd expect them to be put under a bit of pressure to try and get more sponsorship deals etc but pulling out won't even be on the agenda.

percentages dont stand for much when the actual number of vehicle sales are less than impressive to begin with. If I sell 2 cars one year, three the next that is a 50% increase

Julian Mayo wrote:
percentages dont stand for much when the actual number of vehicle sales are less than impressive to begin with. If I sell 2 cars one year, three the next that is a 50% increase

Don't be too harsh on them Julian, at least they are turning a profit. More than can be said for Ford or GMH.

rah wrote:

Julian Mayo wrote:
percentages dont stand for much when the actual number of vehicle sales are less than impressive to begin with. If I sell 2 cars one year, three the next that is a 50% increase

Don't be too harsh on them Julian, at least they are turning a profit. More than can be said for Ford or GMH.

If their percentage increase was in the order of 1:7 % they are not keeping pace with inflation

This is percentage of total sales. Not total profit. I don't think inflation has much to do with it.

No rah, I have no contacts. I just have a lot of respect for a team that became such a success in such a short time.

But it seems you guys would be really happy too see Renault exit Formula 1
The team that ended one of the most boring periods in F1

Perhaps you also like to see Mercedes, Toyota, Honda and BMW pull out too and you'll end with Ferrari and Cosworth perhaps.

Enjoy

JayVee wrote:No rah, I have no contacts. I just have a lot of respect for a team that became such a success in such a short time.

But it seems you guys would be really happy too see Renault exit Formula 1
The team that ended one of the most boring periods in F1

Perhaps you also like to see Mercedes, Toyota, Honda and BMW pull out too and you'll end with Ferrari and Cosworth perhaps.

Enjoy

I for one will be very pissed off if they pull out

JayVee wrote:No rah, I have no contacts. I just have a lot of respect for a team that became such a success in such a short time.

But it seems you guys would be really happy too see Renault exit Formula 1
The team that ended one of the most boring periods in F1

Perhaps you also like to see Mercedes, Toyota, Honda and BMW pull out too and you'll end with Ferrari and Cosworth perhaps.

Enjoy

Lol, I didn't know you could fit so many words in my mouth!

I would hate to see Renault exit F1. If you manage to find a post that says I do then you please let me know where it is. I am of course not seeing them through the magic glasses you are wearing though. A healthy dose of reality does wonders sometimes.

As to the rest, blah blah blah blah blahhhh.

If you both hate to see Renault exit then stop wishing they do because you keep going on and on about how troubled financially they are and how they would have to cut costs and F1 has to be the one.
Ferrari's parent company has been in serious trouble for a few years now but I don't see you mention that
Or is it that if one fool puts something up on the net somewhere you quickly jump on the bandwagon
A healthy dose of reality does wonders for sure

JayVee wrote:If you both hate to see Renault exit then stop wishing they do because you keep going on and on about how troubled financially they are and how they would have to cut costs and F1 has to be the one.
Ferrari's parent company has been in serious trouble for a few years now but I don't see you mention that
Or is it that if one fool puts something up on the net somewhere you quickly jump on the bandwagon
A healthy dose of reality does wonders for sure

Firstly JV you have now pissed me off. I have at no time made any statement that indicates I wish to see Renault leave Formula 1.
I have entered into debate about the parent company only, and the ability of that company to fund the F1 program.
I have also debated Ferrari's financial situation at length during the 2005 season.
In both instances I relied on many sources for my information, including financial newspapers.
If you are so eager to enjoy reality, may I suggest you apply some to your comments about Alonso, who you obviously see, and represent as the greatest driver of any formula at any time since motor racing began.
You make outrageous statements about the engine making capabilities of Renault, when your statistics will show that in the past they have been as capable AS ANY OTHER to produce grenades for the entire season.
I can put up with a hell of a lot, but when you intoduce the word reality, along with theconstant tripe about the driver you switched allegiance to only when it was obvious the JV was an also- ran, I tend to react.

AAAAAhhhhhhh, that feels better

JayVee wrote:If you both hate to see Renault exit then stop wishing they do because you keep going on and on about how troubled financially they are and how they would have to cut costs and F1 has to be the one.
Ferrari's parent company has been in serious trouble for a few years now but I don't see you mention that
Or is it that if one fool puts something up on the net somewhere you quickly jump on the bandwagon
A healthy dose of reality does wonders for sure

I do not wish they do. I am only worried about the prospects due to the attitude of Renault's new boss. I do not think they are in trouble financially, I have even said in a post previous that at least they are making a profit, which is more than can be said for many car makers at present. I do want Renault in F1. They have the money to stay in F1. BUT I beleive that Carlos may think that half the companies profits could be better spent developing new models and growing internationally.

Renault are in much better financial shape than Ferrari, however the bosses at Ferrari and Fiat WANT to be in F1. Weather the same can be said of Renault, only the future can tell. But I am worried.

Oh and as for the bandwagon, that comment is best left to die an early death.

Interesting responses

I am glad that both of you have clarified the issue and I do apologise for taking it a bit too far to provoke a response from you.

I must admit that I do feel that there is an underlying anti Renault feeling here but perhaps I am wrong

Julian, you are "pissed off" at my statements yet you are making exaggerated claims on my behalf.
I never claimed Alonso was the greatest driver of all time. He needs much more than 1 title for me to even consider putting him ahead of Senna.
The allegiance issue was discussed in previous posts but I'll remind you that I started following Alonso in 2004 and JV was OUT OF F1. No need to

And still I admire JV and will always do. I haven't started using FA as my sign in Julian have I ?

And when did Renault produce grenades ? Facts please

rah, Carlos isn't stupid. Even if he doesn't like F1 as you say, he wouldn't pull out at a time when they are grabbing all the headlines. If this year's car is a lemon and it sure isn't then perhaps he'll consider just like any other boss would and that includes Ferrari and FIAT.

I still reckon those rumours about Carlos wanting to pull out are made by people who don't want to see the French better than them .... You know those Button lovers