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sgd wrote:Wow look what I've found here:http://www.planetf1.com/features/race_f ... 9635.shtml

Overtaking Move Of The Race
Lap 71 Nick Heidfeld, BMW-Williams on Alonso
Considering Monaco is a place where you can?t overtake Nick made the most superb overtaking move coming out of the tunnel to get past Alonso.

Television cameras tend to straighten out the road there which curves down to the chicane, but Nick spotted his moment and came very late up the inside of Alonso ? who is NOT an easy man to overtake.

When Heidfeld made the lunge, you felt certain that he hadn?t left enough braking distance and that the BMW-Williams would go sliding, slithering on over the chicane. In fact he got the car stopped and turned in neatly ? it was a beautiful thing to watch. Textbook.

you read that??? TEXTBOOK!! and how was looking at that from just behind???

Notice they say nothing about the slower car! Nick put his move down to Alonso being distracted by it. I prefer to go by his version of events
As well, Alonso was wiser after Nick got him, and positioned his car differently. Basically he was "blocking". In a lot of other types of competitve motor racing, he would have been shown the "Bad Sportsmanship" flag. If then he had not moved over, he would have been served with a drive thru penalty

SGD, my modest attempts on race tracks have shown me it is not possible to conserve tyres and engine when pressuring closely, as Webber was. You are unsighted for the apexes, you have to brake harder, and in different places than you would normally, these cars are less stable in the slipstream, so wear the tyres more, the engine is getting cooked by the superhot air from the car in front. Nick drove a good sensible race, sitting in the box seat, and letting Mark do the work on Alonso. Had their positions been reversed, and Nick had to do the job on Alonso, their podiums would have been reversed...QED

julian mayo wrote:SGD, my modest attempts on race tracks have shown me....

looks like they are indeed to modest. in F1 when a faster car gor stuck a slower one and can't pass the faster car will just keep saving tyres, engine and fuel. if the driver want to overtake he won't push all over the lap but from max 2 corners before the point he have planned to overtake.
Remember Fisichella overtaking Webber in Spain??
read what he said after the race...

I already asked you to think about it but looks like you ignore it:
Webber did his BEST 1st sector on the last lap... think about it...
what does it mean???

sgd wrote:

julian mayo wrote:SGD, my modest attempts on race tracks have shown me....[/quote


Webber did his BEST 1st sector on the last lap... think about it...
what does it mean???

Simple. He was in clean air. Go and read my posts, CAREFULLY> Go and read the Team statement CAREFULLY

I know one thing I did enjoy - when the comentators said "If Webber can get close enough this time into the tunnel.........." and Webber, on a few occasions, looked like he was so close he could lean forward and say to Alonso "got ya this time buddy".

To me, there was one single difference between Webber and Nick - Nick pitted first at their last stop.

Another thing about both passes on Alonso - Alonso had to worry about Webber getting by as well when Nick made his move so staying on line kept Webber back.

Byron Forbes wrote:

To me, there was one single difference between Webber and Nick - Nick pitted first at their last stop.

.

How about creating a "Don't touch Mark Webber (The Perfect)" thread and after each race go and bash whoever beats him (on track that is), whoever holds him up (again on track) and whoever spells his name with just one b

Gee, you guys are sounding like some Ferrari and Michael fans

Now I am outta here

JayVee wrote:How about creating a "Don't touch Mark Webber (The Perfect)" thread and after each race go and bash whoever beats him (on track that is), whoever holds him up (again on track) and whoever spells his name with just one b

Gee, you guys are sounding like some Ferrari and Michael fans

Now I am outta here

Come back here you wuss!
We could enter into sensible, reasonable debate about Webber, and Monaco, JV, but where is the passion and fun in doing that ???

I think Webber is also upset on himself that he couldnt get pass Alonso earlier or when Nick had pitted.Mayb at that time he was distracted/suprised/shocked to see Nick in the pits earlier than him.
Webber should have made his move a couple of laps earlier and things would have been just fine.
I agree Julian,Webber did all the work in cooking up Alonso's tyres but Nick got the fruit.

Kapel wrote:I think Webber is also upset on himself that he couldnt get pass Alonso earlier or when Nick had pitted.Mayb at that time he was distracted/suprised/shocked to see Nick in the pits earlier than him.
Webber should have made his move a couple of laps earlier and things would have been just fine.
I agree Julian,Webber did all the work in cooking up Alonso's tyres but Nick got the fruit.

Aaaahhhh, such is life Kappy

JayVee wrote:How about creating a "Don't touch Mark Webber (The Perfect)" thread and after each race go and bash whoever beats him (on track that is), whoever holds him up (again on track) and whoever spells his name with just one b

Gee, you guys are sounding like some Ferrari and Michael fans

Absolutely!!

Byron Forbes saing that "there was one single difference between Webber and Nick - Nick pitted first at their last stop." is just unbelievable sounds too much like a blind-ferrari fan about MS...

read this pls:

Overtaking Move Of The Race
Lap 71 Nick Heidfeld, BMW-Williams on Alonso
Considering Monaco is a place where you can’t overtake Nick made the most superb overtaking move coming out of the tunnel to get past Alonso.

Television cameras tend to straighten out the road there which curves down to the chicane, but Nick spotted his moment and came very late up the inside of Alonso – who is NOT an easy man to overtake.

When Heidfeld made the lunge, you felt certain that he hadn’t left enough braking distance and that the BMW-Williams would go sliding, slithering on over the chicane. In fact he got the car stopped and turned in neatly – it was a beautiful thing to watch. Textbook.

(From here http://www.planetf1.com/features/race_f ... 9635.shtml )

Later Webber tryed 3 times (!!!) and couldn't do it as good as Nick in neither of those tries... Saying that Alonso put it more difficult to Webber then to Nick is pure ... is a joke!!!

Is getting boring to have to fight with blind MS and Wb fans here...
Montoya or Kimi will do mistakes, I'll be the 1st in accepting that.
My diver now in Montoya, they put him on the back of the field, was that fair??? I don't know. but comming here to say that Montoya would made the McLaren 1-2, that his the best, thet the penalty was BS, etc.... is not the way you disscus with truly F1 fans (to much drivers-fan behavor here... needed more F1 fan behavor, that gives much richer disscusion...)

Two interesting comment in todays papers, folks.
Ralf said his brother "is crazy'".He said that M. had tapped into his darker side, and could have killed them both, with his last minute lunge at the finish line, that there were only millimetres in it.
Barrichello stated that Michael would have taken both ferraris out, if he had not moved aside. He said that if he had not made space, the team would have had no points from Monaco, and could not understand why Michael did it.
I am not making a point, or voicing an opinion.
I am sure the same comments are available from many other sources.
I would be interested to know if Michael had a reply.

julian mayo wrote:Two interesting comment in todays papers, folks.
Ralf said his brother "is crazy'".He said that M. had tapped into his darker side, and could have killed them both, with his last minute lunge at the finish line, that there were only millimetres in it.
Barrichello stated that Michael would have taken both ferraris out, if he had not moved aside. He said that if he had not made space, the team would have had no points from Monaco, and could not understand why Michael did it.
I am not making a point, or voicing an opinion.
I am sure the same comments are available from many other sources.
I would be interested to know if Michael had a reply.

I don't want to add fuel to the fire however had the Ferrari's taken each other out they would have still finished 7th and 8th as Massa in 9th was a lap behind. If they did take each other out, Barrichello would have been classified 7th and Michael 8th (their order on the previous lap).
Of course they may not have known that Massa was already lapped while racing.

And Michael did make a comment "I was only six-hundredths of a second behind Ralf and my attack was acceptable.
I am a full-blooded racer. We're not on a Sunday outing."

According to the BBC

Ed wrote:

julian mayo wrote:Two interesting comment in todays papers, folks.
Ralf said his brother "is crazy'".He said that M. had tapped into his darker side, and could have killed them both, with his last minute lunge at the finish line, that there were only millimetres in it.
Barrichello stated that Michael would have taken both ferraris out, if he had not moved aside. He said that if he had not made space, the team would have had no points from Monaco, and could not understand why Michael did it.
I am not making a point, or voicing an opinion.
I am sure the same comments are available from many other sources.
I would be interested to know if Michael had a reply.

I don't want to add fuel to the fire however had the Ferrari's taken each other out they would have still finished 7th and 8th as Massa in 9th was a lap behind. If they did take each other out, Barrichello would have been classified 7th and Michael 8th (their order on the previous lap).
Of course they may not have known that Massa was already lapped while racing.

And Michael did make a comment "I was only six-hundredths of a second behind Ralf and my attack was acceptable.
I am a full-blooded racer. We're not on a Sunday outing."

According to the BBC

I was amused by Ralfs comments. Given his history of "entanglements" with other drivers, I gather there are times when having " just millimetres in it" are acceptable, and times when there are not.
Just a thought to keep you busy while you blokes laze around til next weekend ED
Who, of the current drivers, has had the most biffs in F1 ? Any stats available?

julian mayo wrote: Just a thought to keep you busy while you blokes laze around til next weekend ED
Who, of the current drivers, has had the most biffs in F1 ? Any stats available?

Shouldn't you be asking the biff experts

Ed wrote:

julian mayo wrote:Two interesting comment in todays papers, folks.
Ralf said his brother "is crazy'".He said that M. had tapped into his darker side, and could have killed them both, with his last minute lunge at the finish line, that there were only millimetres in it.
Barrichello stated that Michael would have taken both ferraris out, if he had not moved aside. He said that if he had not made space, the team would have had no points from Monaco, and could not understand why Michael did it.
I am not making a point, or voicing an opinion.
I am sure the same comments are available from many other sources.
I would be interested to know if Michael had a reply.

I don't want to add fuel to the fire however had the Ferrari's taken each other out they would have still finished 7th and 8th as Massa in 9th was a lap behind. If they did take each other out, Barrichello would have been classified 7th and Michael 8th (their order on the previous lap).
Of course they may not have known that Massa was already lapped while racing.

And Michael did make a comment "I was only six-hundredths of a second behind Ralf and my attack was acceptable.
I am a full-blooded racer. We're not on a Sunday outing."

According to the BBC

You know, i like it!!! MS begins to understand he has nothing to lose!! . This also shows he's psychologically desperado...



I Think we'll be seeing him doing more of that "bloody" stuff... will be funny to see him crash race after race

PEOPLE DON'T PICK MS IN THE 8'N'POLE IF YOU WANT TO GET BETTER THERE!!! (at least for the next 3 races)

You'll be better Pick McLaren and Renault for their first 1-2-3-4 of the year... in Germany!!!!!