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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 9:47 am
by Julian Mayo
mlittle wrote:With all the controversy over the fiasco at the USGP and the proposed FIA/GPWC rules in 2008, here are some suggestions for any new rules and/or rules changes(many of these are in use in IRL/ChampCar):
1-Eliminate the traction controls and reduce the rpms' in the engine from where they're at now(17-19K) to between 10.5K-12K. This'll help the engines make it through two race weekends, as it stands now.
2-Get rid of the grooved tires, and put the slicks back on. Come to think of it, could those Michelin-grooved tires be part of the reason for the fiasco, what, with the reduced grip surface on them?
3-Allow teams to make changes to the car, if necessary, between qualifying and racetime, unless they have to change an engine, transmission or other major item. If that happens let 'em start at the back of the grid.
4-Allow all teams the option of using either carbon-fiber OR steel rotor brakes, as the IndyCar series required teams to use for the series' 3 non-oval races. This might allow for greater overtaking during a GP race, especially on tracks where braking and cornerning are at a premium.
5-Using common ECU packages similar to what ChampCar requires now since 2003. Also, the FIA/GPWC should require engines to not only last the 2 race wkends but for a specific distance before they can replaced. in the ChampCar series, all teams use the Ford-Cosworth XFE 2.65L turbo-engine, and it is designed to last for a minimum dist. of 750 miles(about 3-5 races). Since 2003, not 1 of their engines has failed during a race weekend, none. How many of F1's vaunted engines can say that?
6-Finally, the teams should be restricted in how much testing they can do, but not if they're testing a new car or engine package. Once they're used in race conditions, however, the restrictions would 'kick' back in.
Too much thought and commonsense there. It will never fly
Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 10:02 am
by mlittle
You may be right, julian, on that one. It was worth a shot, though.
Just out of curiousity, was there anything in those suggestions that you liked?
Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 1:23 pm
by Julian Mayo
mlittle wrote:You may be right, julian, on that one. It was worth a shot, though.
Just out of curiousity, was there anything in those suggestions that you liked?
My recipe
common ecus, sealed and delivered, and scrutineered after every race.
5 litre V8s no rev limit ( the nature of the engine configuration will limit sufficiently)
pit to car radio transmission. no other form of monitoring or communication or down/upload.
manual Gbox,n clutch
optional carbon/steel brakes
single tyre, free compound choice from 3 (dry)compounds
no changes permitted between Q and race unless something broke in Qual.
1 engine, drive-train package per meet,free change if it breaks in P or Q
only testing to be on thursday prior to each meet.3 x 2 hour sessions
Friday 3 x 1 hour free practice
Saturday 5 lap Qual, 1 car at a time, any fuel config they choose
Free pit stops for tyres, fuel, but not at the same time!> mech repairs,/adjustments at either
And Cut The Bloody Aero To Enough To Safely Keep The Cars Groundborne
Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 1:40 pm
by mlittle
Thanks for the response, julian. Here's some suggestions for how they could conduct qual./prac. sessions during a GP race weekend:
Practice:2 sessions FRI and SAT, 45 mins. each session, unlimited no. of laps allowed
Qualifyling:2 sessions SAT...Session 1 to be 30 minutes long w/all cars on track(similar to CCWS rules) in full-fuel and race set-ups; qual. order for single-car (Session 2) qualifying based on order from #1, again w/full-fuel and race set-up qual.
Prior to the race, they should allow a 25-min. warm-up session to get the cars ready & to get one last shot at set-ups before the race. Once race time beckons, put the cars on the grid, send 'em around on their formation lap, set them on the grid, drop the lights, and let 'em fly, my friend.
Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 3:04 pm
by Julian Mayo
mlittle wrote:Thanks for the response, julian. Here's some suggestions for how they could conduct qual./prac. sessions during a GP race weekend:
Practice:2 sessions FRI and SAT, 45 mins. each session, unlimited no. of laps allowed
Qualifyling:2 sessions SAT...Session 1 to be 30 minutes long w/all cars on track(similar to CCWS rules) in full-fuel and race set-ups; qual. order for single-car (Session 2) qualifying based on order from #1, again w/full-fuel and race set-up qual.
Prior to the race, they should allow a 25-min. warm-up session to get the cars ready & to get one last shot at set-ups before the race. Once race time beckons, put the cars on the grid, send 'em around on their formation lap, set them on the grid, drop the lights, and let 'em fly, my friend.
As long as they can only test, practice n race what they brung, I am prepared to listen to reason, then disagree vehemently
Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 3:27 pm
by mlittle
My point exactly, julian. Ironically, that's exactly what the philosophy at Indy used to be--you ran whatever you brought at the beginning of May, you qualified for the race, you set the car up on Carburation Day, and then you ran the 500. Now, unless you were one of the drivers with either a Honda engine, a Roger Penske-prepared Toyota, or a "ChevWorth" engine, you had no shot of winning the race this year. Of course, it also didn't help that they eviscerated the qualifying rules in the hopes of seeing someone get "bumped" from the field on each of the 4 qual. sessions.
Oh, and what is a "ChevWorth" engine? Simply put, its' a 3.0L Ford-Cosworth XFE normally-aspirated engine with the Chevrolet "Bow-Tie" logo badged onto it. You see, back in 2003, when Toyota and Honda left ChampCar for the Indy Racing League, they essentially caught Chevy w/their pants down, so to speak, w/about a 30-40 hp advantage. Normally, in American open-wheel racing, the engine specs are supposed to stay inviolate through the entire season, but George and Co. allowed Chevy to purchase a couple of dozen FC engines, badge 'em as Chevys', and let them run the second half of the IndyCar season that year with what was essentially a Ford-built engine.
Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 1:35 pm
by Graham Ross
I am against any standard components.
I use the standard refuelling rigs as an example. How many races were ruined by this standard device ? When a team has no say in their brakes or gearboxes or ECU's they will be at the mercy of the supplier.
And what if we have a situation where the supplied standard brakes are not up to it ? A race like Canada is very hard on brakes. Do they get offered two types of brakes ???
If this happens we will have a single manufacturer with the rest just clones and that isn't Formula 1
Learn from history not go back in it
Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 1:47 pm
by Julian Mayo
Graham Ross wrote:I am against any standard components.
I use the standard refuelling rigs as an example. How many races were ruined by this standard device ? When a team has no say in their brakes or gearboxes or ECU's they will be at the mercy of the supplier.
And what if we have a situation where the supplied standard brakes are not up to it ? A race like Canada is very hard on brakes. Do they get offered two types of brakes ???
If this happens we will have a single manufacturer with the rest just clones and that isn't Formula 1
Learn from history not go back in it
I agree about the brakes, I think they should have theoption, depending on the track. I don't see a problem with the control ECU. I t works in many other formulae, and stops a lot of cheating
Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 8:30 pm
by Kapel
As we all are eagerly awaiting the result of "dreaded meeting" something that crossed my mind got me thinking(as usual its a speculation or some would call a wish list)
90% of the F1 fans have blamed the FIA of not handling the US situation in a way the World council body is suppose to & this led to the farsce(Lets leave Michelin aside here).Mad Max was to be blamed,for his ego & stubborness.
(Bernie was seen disappointed with Max at USGP & the fiasco)
As Bernie controls the rights for Formula One at the moment & was successful in luring Ferrari in joining the FIA run series beyond 2007,by offering them lucrative financial options;
Cant Bernie , with the money he has,offer other teams similar money,back the GPWC,get Ferrari back in there & start of a parallel series
immediately if any of the teams are banned today?????
Is it possible for him to ditch the contract with the FIA's at this stage????
Just random thought when i'm on Ice tea....
Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2005 12:39 am
by Ed
The FIA released a follow-up note on their proposed 2008 regulations asking all stakeholders to "consider carefully the technology/cost issue and let us have their views. Which technologies to allow and even encourage is a decision of fundamental importance, as is the question of cost. "
The FIA do not want technology that help the drivers however they would encourage technologies that could improve performance such as energy recovery.
Full Statement
Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2005 1:03 am
by Julian Mayo
Ed wrote:The FIA released a follow-up note on their proposed 2008 regulations asking all stakeholders to "consider carefully the technology/cost issue and let us have their views. Which technologies to allow and even encourage is a decision of fundamental importance, as is the question of cost. "
The FIA do not want technology that help the drivers however they would encourage technologies that could improve performance such as energy recovery.
Full Statement
ED, my read on this is a conciliatory move from the FIA, with regard to
1. The banks
2.2008
With regard to "energy recovery" I see that as an attempt to attract to the sport sponsors who would normally look upon F1 as a wanton vandal of energy.
3.Mad Max has just been slapped up the ear with the worst thing of all....stark reality.
I.E. Once the manufacturers gain control from the "Banks", and right now...IMHO.. the Banks would be more than happy to sell back to Bernie, and slink off to do what Banks do best
Then Max can either reign supreme over a 3 team (at best) F1 series, while the likes of Bundy, Kapel, Bryan, Rah,K-D, my kids etc spend their money on merchandise from another series.
IMHO. I forsee an F1 series run by various entrants, who put up serious money to compete...AS INDIVIDUALS....And they run to regulations they set.....and are administered by a totally autonomous body....Da Da... the FIA. A La Cams...
Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2005 1:36 am
by Ed
There appears to be a positive atmosphere in Formula 1 at the moment. Lets hope all parties agree on a way forward on the financial side and then the technical people from the the teams can discuss the regulations for 2008.
Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2005 8:00 am
by Julian Mayo
Ed wrote:There appears to be a positive atmosphere in Formula 1 at the moment. Lets hope all parties agree on a way forward on the financial side and then the technical people from the the teams can discuss the regulations for 2008.
Isn't there an FIA election around October? Maybe Mad Max wants to leave a workable legacy before he steps down.
Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:18 am
by Ed
It has been widely expected and now it is official. Red Bull have agreed to extend the Concorde Agreement until 2012.
A statement by the team read "Red Bull Racing confirms that it has reached an understanding with FOA to prolong the current Concorde Agreement from 2008 until 2012."
They become the second team (after Ferrari) to commit to Formula 1 beyond the expiry of the Concorde Agreement at the end of the 2007 season.
Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 8:16 am
by Julian Mayo
Red Bull = Ferrari "B" Team.