The Spanish Grand Prix (Kimi Raikkonen wins!)

Julian Mayo · Post by **Julian Mayo** » Wed May 04, 2005 3:27 pm

Not hot enough

sgd · Post by **sgd** » Wed May 04, 2005 3:41 pm

Ed wrote:Weather forecast updated.

Latest: Sunday 22 with showers!

friday? saturday?
sunday showers morning or night??

K-D · Post by **K-D** » Wed May 04, 2005 4:06 pm

julian mayo wrote:
Graham Ross wrote:K-D I have to agree with sgd here

The verdict is still out. Maybe Montoya is harder on tryes but Raikkonen is harder on the car. Which is better ?
Montoya has only raced for 2 races so you cannot tell for sure

And I reckon Montoya will beat Raikkonen this year

(sgd is being very reasonable )

and SGD is being VERY reasonable

I disagree, I have written a post about Montoya and why his talent is to an extent not suited to F1, as it is currently regulated. I am not going to repeat that at every race.

Montoya is a hugely talented driver, on his day he is as good as any driver. But his style handicaps him over a season, and even with Kimi being a car-breaker he is still clearly a better F1 driver under the current F1 regulations.

I think that BAR may be thrown out of the championship after the hearing. Blatent cheating if they are found to guilty mean exclusion from the championship for a period.

Kapel · Post by **Kapel** » Wed May 04, 2005 5:11 pm

Recent poll in the "F1 racing" magazine in May issue,they asked 72 insiders - including ex-drivers, world champions, team personnel, journalists and fans to rate their best drivers:-
Raikkonen, McLaren's 25-year-old Finn, earned 27 (to Fernando Alonso's sixteen) votes. "He has lightening speed," said 1979 champion Jody Scheckter, while 1996 title winner Damon Hill singled out KR's near mistake-free talent.

Ferrari's Rubens Barrichello earned nine votes, Giancarlo Fisichella eight, and Juan Pablo Montoya - Kimi's Colombian-born teammate - three. "Kimi may be quiet," fellow Finn and '98-'99 champion Mika Hakkinen added, "but he's got a champion's confidence."

Well Well Well.....

But i would still debate on the discussion happening on this forum,KIMI vs JUAN.. Both drivers have that in them to be successful WDC and it would be fair to Montoya that he's given atleast a year to settle in that Mclaren before drawing camparison to Kimi.

My feeling are that they would be equal.

Some circuits will suit Kimi's style while others Montoya's style...lets discuss whose better at the end of this season

BTW,any1 has news on Montoya chances for this weekend????

Kapel · Post by **Kapel** » Wed May 04, 2005 5:15 pm

Ed wrote:Weather forecast updated.

Latest: Sunday 22 with showers!

I hope ED your forecast is true and it does rain

Come NK !!!

(Rain is his only hope for securing one point)

K-D · Post by **K-D** » Wed May 04, 2005 5:17 pm

I don't care for any poll of any select group. It's a popularity contest in another name. The ony way to fully gauge two drivers against each other, is to see how they team up against each other on the track, over an extended period of time.

Both Kimi and Juan Pablo have been in F1 long enough for all of us to have an opinion, and based on who you like yo call it as one over the other, or a tie.

I personally have no doubt that Kimi is clearly a better F1 driver than Juan Pablo. Make that a poll of 1 person in denamrk, and 100% of the poll group think so.

Kapel · Post by **Kapel** » Wed May 04, 2005 5:33 pm

Come to India in some small village in Chennai,they only Narain Kathikeyan

...apparently an intervue was was being done in samll villages where they hardly get to see the race,but for ppl there NK was he's the only Fromula 1 driver in the world

JayVee · Post by **JayVee** » Wed May 04, 2005 5:33 pm

K-D wrote:I personally have no doubt that Kimi is clearly a better F1 driver than Juan Pablo.

K-D, you like the word clearly don't you!

Well you have clearly not stated that when you put up your preview of the season. At that time you said this:

K-D wrote:.... The contenders in 2005 will be:

Michael Schumacher
Kimi Raikkonen
Juan Pablo Montoya
Fernando Alonso

I will be VERY surprised if any other drivers make a real push for the championship, with the relative weakness that I suspect Ferrari will have in 2005, there is no way that Rubens Barichello will be able to (or allowed for that matter) to contend for the championship, and my personal opinion is that neither will Giancarlo Fisichella.

Kimi Raikkonen and Juan Pablo Montoya will bring out the very best in each other, and my biggest question mark about McLaren is the engine, and to see if Kimi is a car-breaker or not.

You clearly state Barrichello and Fisichella won't contend for the championship but in fact have Montoya as a candidate. And in your blurb about McLaren you don't mention anything about one being clearly better than the other.

Something happened during this season that made you say clearly but with only two races as team-mates, that is way too premature

K-D · Post by **K-D** » Wed May 04, 2005 5:47 pm

JayVee wrote:
K-D wrote:I personally have no doubt that Kimi is clearly a better F1 driver than Juan Pablo.
K-D, you like the word clearly don't you!

Well you have clearly not stated that when you put up your preview of the season. At that time you said this:

K-D wrote:.... The contenders in 2005 will be:

Michael Schumacher
Kimi Raikkonen
Juan Pablo Montoya
Fernando Alonso

I will be VERY surprised if any other drivers make a real push for the championship, with the relative weakness that I suspect Ferrari will have in 2005, there is no way that Rubens Barichello will be able to (or allowed for that matter) to contend for the championship, and my personal opinion is that neither will Giancarlo Fisichella.

Kimi Raikkonen and Juan Pablo Montoya will bring out the very best in each other, and my biggest question mark about McLaren is the engine, and to see if Kimi is a car-breaker or not.
You clearly state Barrichello and Fisichella won't contend for the championship but in fact have Montoya as a candidate. And in your blurb about McLaren you don't mention anything about one being clearly better than the other.

Something happened during this season that made you say clearly but with only two races as team-mates, that is way too premature

I will try to refrain from using certain words to much.

There is obviously a distinction between my call for how the 2005 season would pan out, posted before the seaosn start, and then how I see reality now.

In addition there is a clear difference between the performance of a given driven in one out of many seasons, and then of a given driver in a specific season.

Lastly I learn every day, since the posting of my season predictions I have learned how certain driving traits will be at a disadvantage compared to others, and that the "seat of the pants" drivers will underperform on occasion, this the reason that Villeneuve and Montoya are and will be having a difficult time in 2005.

There is no doubt in my mind that Kimi is a better F1 driver than Juan Pablo.

JayVee · Post by **JayVee** » Wed May 04, 2005 5:57 pm

K-D wrote: I will try to refrain from using certain words to much.

There is obviously a distinction between my call for how the 2005 season would pan out, posted before the seaosn start, and then how I see reality now.

In addition there is a clear difference between the performance of a given driven in one out of many seasons, and then of a given driver in a specific season.

Lastly I learn every day, since the posting of my season predictions I have learned how certain driving traits will be at a disadvantage compared to others, and that the "seat of the pants" drivers will underperform on occasion, this the reason that Villeneuve and Montoya are and will be having a difficult time in 2005.

There is no doubt in my mind that Kimi is a better F1 driver than Juan Pablo.

K-D, you won't get away that easily,

Now you are talking about this season specifically. If that is the case 2 races aren't enough to make a 'no doubt in my mind' judgement. Add to that Raikkonen was at McLaren for much much longer than Montoya

And that is what I have been saying.

Gee you're a stubborn Betelgeuzean

K-D · Post by **K-D** » Wed May 04, 2005 6:11 pm

JayVee wrote:
K-D wrote: I will try to refrain from using certain words to much.

There is obviously a distinction between my call for how the 2005 season would pan out, posted before the seaosn start, and then how I see reality now.

In addition there is a clear difference between the performance of a given driven in one out of many seasons, and then of a given driver in a specific season.

Lastly I learn every day, since the posting of my season predictions I have learned how certain driving traits will be at a disadvantage compared to others, and that the "seat of the pants" drivers will underperform on occasion, this the reason that Villeneuve and Montoya are and will be having a difficult time in 2005.

There is no doubt in my mind that Kimi is a better F1 driver than Juan Pablo.

K-D, you won't get away that easily,

Now you are talking about this season specifically. If that is the case 2 races aren't enough to make a 'no doubt in my mind' judgement. Add to that Raikkonen was at McLaren for much much longer than Montoya

And that is what I have been saying.

Gee you're a stubborn Betelgeuzean

Sorry to correct you JayVee, but we are discussing more than one thing here.

1) is Kimi a better F1 driver than Juan Pablo this season?? - K-D says yes.

2) Is Kimi a better F1 driver than Juan Pablo under the currect rules and regulations?? - K-D says yes.

JayVee · Post by **JayVee** » Wed May 04, 2005 6:14 pm

K-D wrote:Sorry to correct you JayVee, but we are discussing more than one thing here.

1) is Kimi a better F1 driver than Juan Pablo this season?? - K-D says yes.

2) Is Kimi a better F1 driver than Juan Pablo under the currect rules and regulations?? - K-D says yes.

Correct what ? Did I say anything wrong

I have to watch what I say these days

1) Probably but I'd rather wait for at least 6 races as team-mates
2) Probably but I'd rather wait for at least 6 races as team-mates

They will be close though. Clearly

much closer than Michael / Rubens and Fernando / Giancarlo

Kapel · Post by **Kapel** » Wed May 04, 2005 6:34 pm

JayVee wrote: They will be close though. Clearly much closer than Michael / Rubens and Fernando / Giancarlo

Agreed it will be close,though Raikkonen looks to be better,but i'll hold my judgement for now....

Sure JayVee they'll be much closer than..........NK/Monteiro

K-D would also agree than there cant be a much of a difference between the 2,once Montoya is settle at Mclaren.

Julian Mayo · Post by **Julian Mayo** » Wed May 04, 2005 6:42 pm

BORING

K-D · Post by **K-D** » Wed May 04, 2005 6:43 pm

Kapel wrote:...
K-D would also agree than there cant be a much of a difference between the 2,once Montoya is settle at Mclaren.

Absolutely. On some raceweekends he will dominate Kimi and run away with the race, I just do not see him doing that over a season.