My Man Button...

F1-NUT · Post by **F1-NUT** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 4:45 pm

F1-NUT wrote:It begins...

...ish

Great race in Melbourne though, can't believe they stopped Jense from crossing finishing linejust to avoid an engine penalty - madness!

Ed · Post by Ed » Sun Apr 02, 2006 6:54 pm

Very much doubt that to be the case. When an engine blows, you don't have much control over where the car stops. Besides, 4 points are far more worth to the team than a 10 place grid penalty. They were just unlucky but they do get the benefit of getting a fresh engine in San Marino.

Julian Mayo · Post by **Julian Mayo** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 8:20 pm

F1-NUT wrote:
F1-NUT wrote:It begins...
...ish

Great race in Melbourne though, can't believe they stopped Jense from crossing finishing linejust to avoid an engine penalty - madness!

The pistons welded themselves to the block, and various pieces of metal went where they had no right to be. That tends to have detrimental effect on the forward rotation of the rear wheels.

F1-NUT · Post by **F1-NUT** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 10:12 pm

Julian Mayo wrote:
F1-NUT wrote:
F1-NUT wrote:It begins...
...ish

Great race in Melbourne though, can't believe they stopped Jense from crossing finishing linejust to avoid an engine penalty - madness!
The pistons welded themselves to the block, and various pieces of metal went where they had no right to be. That tends to have detrimental effect on the forward rotation of the rear wheels.

Duh! On the ITV coverage, they stated that Honda told Button to not pass the line, and it looked like he could've done, as he was able to pull it in before it seized. I'm sure we will get the full story soon.

Julian Mayo · Post by **Julian Mayo** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 12:20 am

F1-NUT wrote:
Julian Mayo wrote:
F1-NUT wrote:
...ish

Great race in Melbourne though, can't believe they stopped Jense from crossing finishing linejust to avoid an engine penalty - madness!
The pistons welded themselves to the block, and various pieces of metal went where they had no right to be. That tends to have detrimental effect on the forward rotation of the rear wheels.
Duh! On the ITV coverage, they stated that Honda told Button to not pass the line, and it looked like he could've done, as he was able to pull it in before it seized. I'm sure we will get the full story soon.

As I understand the rules, had he crossed the line, he would take a 10 place penalty at Imola for taking a new engine

Ed · Post by Ed » Mon Apr 03, 2006 1:39 am

If Button was outside the points, it is understandable that the team would like him not to cross the line (to avoid the engine penalty). He was in the points in 5th, even when Fisichella past him he was 6th, Villeneuve was over 11 seconds behind so Button would have been able to cross the line in 6th and score 3 points. This assumes of course that he had control but when an engine goes, the rears usually jam and the car doesn't move.
I don't think any team would be willing to trade points to save an engine penalty. If the team did tell him, it would be a precautionary move after knowing that he has no chance of scoring.

F1greyhound · Post by **F1greyhound** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 1:53 am

Hey ED,

dont hurt these guys, they cant live without conspiracy theories....by the way FERRARI told MICHAEL to crash to avoid all kinds of penalties and speculation, a major step to win IMOLA.

JUAN PABLO was told the same in order to get a few more races at MCLAREN before being replaced by someone causing less trouble for KIMI.

GIANCARLOs engine was stopped by remote control before the start to make the road free for FERNANDO.

Dont know what they told NICK and RUBENS but they had to make room for other teams...

CHEERS!

Bundy · Post by **Bundy** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 11:56 am

I thought this was going to be the race for JB. The day when I had to come here and offer my humble apologies for every negative post about him.

I live to post again!!

The only driver looking capable of beating FA is Fisi. Had he not stalled on the line I think their battle would have been epic. Honda are quick, they had a good strategy but they still can't compete.

JayVee · Post by **JayVee** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 4:36 pm

Fisi

We saw him last year and in the last race, if he has a problem, he can't adjust, he just struggles. The team telling him to push was evidence of that.
By contrast, Alonso in the last race managed to fight for second despite having a double fuel load at the start.
There is a huge difference between the two but given the state of the other teams and/or their drivers, and assuming Alonso will hit some trouble in a few races, then yes I would say Fisichella will be the closest to him ............. still 30 or 40 points behind

But back to the topic, I felt really sorry for his engine failure at the end of the race. He reminded me of Mansell's luck

F1-NUT · Post by **F1-NUT** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:10 pm

Yep, bad luck for Button - just before the finishing line (and it wasn't my 'conspiracy theory' that Button was told to pull up but as reported on ITV coverage)! My heart was pounding at the start, but as the race progressed my chin did a Barricello-like drop as Button fell further and further back. Shame also for Webber, would have loved to have seen him in the points. And how did Ralf get up there? Will have to watch the recording back to work that one out...

I can't say I'm surprised about Barricello, and not wanting to gloat (too much), but I thought when Honda signed him it was a terrible move and I just did not get all the pre-season debate about him being faster than Button. Three races in and he's still moaning about the brake...

Fisi? He has concentration problems, and despite his occasional flashes of real brilliance, he's a no-no as far as I'm concerned. And as for humiliatiing him like that over the radio - that will backfire as spectactuly as it did with Trulli. Cue major tantrums and fallouts.

Great, great, disappointing GP. Still, a big cheer when Schuie put it in the wall and walked into the wrong garage...marvelous.

Snowy · Post by **Snowy** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:04 pm

I think the car being this difficult to adapt to says a lot about Jenson's driving style. Perhaps they have gone seriously wrong in the development of the car or the setup. Perhaps they are making the wrong decisions about the car based on Jenson's preferences and if they were to try using Ruben's knowledge and integrate it with the team perhaps Jens wouldn't end up driving a wheel barrow round the circuit quite so often. Just a thought.

Snowy · Post by **Snowy** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:09 pm

JayVee wrote:Fisi We saw him last year and in the last race, if he has a problem, he can't adjust, he just struggles. The team telling him to push was evidence of that.
By contrast, Alonso in the last race managed to fight for second despite having a double fuel load at the start.
There is a huge difference between the two but given the state of the other teams and/or their drivers, and assuming Alonso will hit some trouble in a few races, then yes I would say Fisichella will be the closest to him ............. still 30 or 40 points behind

But back to the topic, I felt really sorry for his engine failure at the end of the race. He reminded me of Mansell's luck

Everybody was suffering from tyre problems apart from Fernando, his engineer telling Fisi that he was two seconds a lap slower than Fernando was perhaps a little unfair as he was stuck in dirty air 90% of the race.

F1-NUT · Post by **F1-NUT** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:18 pm

Snowy wrote:Perhaps they are making the wrong decisions about the car based on Jenson's preferences and if they were to try using Ruben's knowledge and integrate it with the team perhaps Jens wouldn't end up driving a wheel barrow round the circuit quite so often. Just a thought.

Jenson is a great, smooth, fast driver - this is obviously a chassis problem, the car is not getting enough heat into the tyres quick enough.

'Barricello's knowledge?' - what can he possibly offer? He spent three seasons driving the fastest car in the paddock, being dragged along by the devlopment talent of Schuie. Do you really think he was that involved at Ferrari? Cos I don't. I prefered Sato - and that's saying something. And are they going to listen to Rubens anyway after three such disappointing races.? No is the answer. Honda must be sertiously worried about the Constructor's Championship with Rubens between 1 and 2 seconds off Button's pace. They have 3 weeks now to fix the chassis problem - expect something mighty from Honda when they get back.

Snowy · Post by **Snowy** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:54 pm

You are presuming that Schuey is not mortal, everyone has a weakness and develoing and setting up the car might be his achilles heal. There are numeruos instances where he has floundered during early practice and had to steal the setup off his team mates. I don't think you can dismiss Ruben's talents so lightly, he was shackled at Ferarri, but he knows a thing or two about driving a formula one race car IMHO

F1-NUT · Post by **F1-NUT** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 11:05 pm

Snowy wrote:You are presuming that Schuey is not mortal, everyone has a weakness and develoing and setting up the car might be his achilles heal. There are numeruos instances where he has floundered during early practice and had to steal the setup off his team mates.

Yep, true enough, But 'set-up' is very diferent from 'development' and this is not a set-up issue. Button hooked up the Honda after hardly any practice, and he's been vey good at set-up all his career. I doubt he will be borrowing anything from the slower driver. From Davidson - yes of course, but from brake-problem Barricello? I don't think so. Rubens was almost blubbing on his radio. He's deadwood. Would love to see Davidson in the Honda by the way.

This is an engineer's problem, not a driver's problem. Button proved that in Qually!!!