Is Michael retiring ? (Michael to retire at end of 2006)

gkaytaz · Post by **gkaytaz** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 3:50 pm

Hold yer fire while I make a beeline to the door.

JayVee · Post by **JayVee** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 4:11 pm

Kapel wrote:
JayVee wrote:
Kapel wrote:
http://www.formula1.com/race/news/4842/764.html
Read the comment by Doornbos.Well i'm sure u can make something out of this todefend ur ALonso who was bullying this driver.

Also u can go back on this forum article "Turkish GP" page 8..though Ed was very polite in his comments...

All i'm trying to say here is that ppl in power do use it to their advantage i.e. bullying smaller team drivers by his status of F1 champion..which Alonsa has does this year twice ...this is just a start...more to come in years
Your assumptions make it clear that you have a personal issue with Alonso.

I don't know what you achieve by making up stories, just to spice up things or in the hope that you change people's opinion ?

A few posts earlier in this thread you said:

Kapel wrote:JayVee,you probably seemed to have overlookd the article on Alonso crashing in practise in the very next GP trying to bully a slower car,a smaller team...U will ofcourse...go find it...i dont make things up...tell me if u cant..i will for u...
Then when I tell you to prove it you come up with a link that points to this:
Robert Doornbos, third driver, Red Bull (7th, +0.757s):
?It?s a great circuit here and Turkey?s a great place to be. We were unfortunate today as the car had some problems, meaning we lost track time and weren?t that competitive. But, most importantly, we have an answer on the tyres, which is what we?re here for so that?s good. I had a bit of an incident towards the end of the session. Everyone?s trying to put in good laps, I was on a good time and ended up in a bit of a ?chicken? game with Alonso. It was a case of ?who?s going to brake latest?, but that?s all there was to it."
And you refer to Ed's quote on page 8 of the Turkish GP, I think you meant this:
Ed wrote:Another incident between Alonso and Doornbos. Alonso appears to be overtaking Doornbos, both leave it too late and lock up their tyres. They appear to have touched but from another angle it doesn't seem so!
In neither reference does it say that Alonso crashed into Doornbos.

Unfortunately in Australia we don't get to see practice sessions so I cannot comment on what happened first hand. Perhaps Ed can tell us more about this incident but it certainly wasn't a crash and if Alonso had done anything wrong he would have been penalised.

To link this and the penalty in Hungary and to describe it as "the start" and more to come in years is ridiculous and shows how desparate you are to find anything on Alonso.

Making up stories Kapel doesn't help your case.
As expected...like always.
I think there's no point bringing to ur notice that power drivers of every era have tried to bully other driver..be it Senna or Michael or Alonso for now...on track dirty tricks,probably Michael's were more and even more highlighted than his previous super drivers...
I condemn what Senna did(so wht if he announced it before the start of the race),defi wht Michael did...but it doesnt make him the most unsporting driver in history(which btw,JayVee, Alonso backtracked on his statement)

I've nothing against Alonso,which ur trying to emphasize for reason known to u best (Probably u want be Alonso's biggest fan & dont want new entries )

All the best JayVee

Trying to compare the numerous dirty tricks of Michael to one brake test incident from Alonso just shows your desparation Kapel.

If you are really irritated by drivers brake testing other drivers how come you said nothing when Montoya did that in Monaco last year ? (And he actually caused a crash).
Just shows how much of a personal issue you have with Alonso

Anyway, you said Alonso went on to crash into Doornbos in the next race but you provided links with no proof of that.

SO PROVE IT or are you backtracking.

Kapel · Post by **Kapel** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 4:28 pm

U choose to ignore it .It was a crash with limited damage to both cars...i cant talk to blindfolded fans like u here..
If u read Doornbos statement clearly,he mentioned he was a fast lap but it was Alonso who spoiled it.Y? Cos Doornbos has no rgt to do a good lap as he's not a championship contenter? But for u,Alonso must have the rgt of way always rgt?
Choose ur way...
I'm not comapring brack testing incidents of Alonso with Michael's dirty on track tricks...Mayb i dont know English that well as u do & my language conveying capabilitis is less...

My point is, b'cos of ur hatred u potray one driver as the most unsporting cos ur blue eyed driver made a comment which he backtracked,every super driver has done deeds which are unacceptable to fans,some more some less...& Alonso is no God ,he's has also started to do things which he's not supose to with 1 WDC(2)...

U obviously have a problem with ppl who pinpoint wht ur blue eyed boy did...N i'm here saying every driver in his stature does it !!!!

U can choose to ignore it..& we'll talk after 16 years of driving of his...how many unsporting deeds has he committed...cos this is just a beginning...
N if u say brake testing is permitted & acceptable & not dangerous & not dirty then i dunno wht to think..
One has to ruthless if one has the ambitions to achieve a feet...some go out of control & do things which they should & some just r not made of such elements...If One has the power & influence,they use it..sometimes for wrong reasons.

JayVee · Post by **JayVee** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 4:46 pm

Kapel,

Without proof of a crash and the limited damage, you are just dreaming up a theory. Surely a crash involving Alonso would have made headlines but since there wasn't one you can't find any proof.

Evidence that no crash occured can be taken from what Doornbos himself said (I posted it above so everyone can read it). But again he said:

"Everyone?s trying to put in good laps, I was on a good time and ended up in a bit of a ?chicken? game with Alonso. It was a case of ?who?s going to brake latest?, but that?s all there was to it"

He doesn't even say they touched.

BTW: Never have I ignored a truth on any driver whoever it is.

BTW2: I finally found what I was looking for. Proof that you have a personal issue with Alonso.

Back in August 23 2005 you said:

Kapel wrote:Sorry JayVee,Alonso would have almost all the qualities mentioned,he's fast no doubt,but this guy is very rude & arrogant!!!
This is through personal experience last year at Bahrain GP,where i met all the drivers!!!!
He was so arrogant & full of himself with only 1 race victory to his name,imagine his arrongance growing with 1 WDC
Sorry,he's not a gentleman in terms of personality!!!

And then you claim (without proof) that he never congratulates the winner and that he is a bad loser.

Obviously you have a problem with the guy.

Say whatever you want Kapel, this little discussion just showed how much you dislike the guy.

I'll just end with two comments made by Damon Hill and Jackie Stewart on Alonso:
Hill said:

There is also a sense of honour with Alonso. I think there is a way in which he wants to win which is as important to him as winning, and that was manifestly apparent with his reaction to happened to him in Monza, when he felt he'd been unjustly treated.
I don't know the whole history with Alonso, but it seems that this is something that is necessary for him, to show he is the best in an honourable way

Stewart said:

Of the 22 Grand Prix drivers there's usually only about six that are really, really good. And out of those six there are usually only three extraordinary talents at one time. And out of those three there is generally only one genius at any one time.
For a short window of time there might have been Alain Prost and Ayrton Senna together, but that was a rare occasion.
There is generally only one genius at any one time and I think you're going to see Alonso taking on that mantle.
I think the time has come when it is clear that Alonso is tomorrow and Michael is yesterday.

From the BBC website (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsp ... 040062.stm)

Hill and Stewart aren't blue eyed the last time I checked.

Kapel · Post by **Kapel** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 5:06 pm

JayVee,firstly make up ur mind...r v talking of on track or off track for drivers...cos ur beautiful in plugging & mixing 2 post at ur convenience...
Alonso off track on a personal note was an aweful experience...very arrogant & rude...i still abide by that...whereas all other drivers even ex driver were humble & spoke & gave a minute...But as a fan of F1 i'm not here to judge waht he does off track(even u said it rgt abt Michael).

I dunno y r u so insistance tht i dislike Alonso,probably its ur bloody personal interest,i dont know i dont care....Probably i'm the only blindfolded non-blue eyed fan here who has always given the same appreciation to Alonso as i've done for my fav driver...U cant even come close to appreciating a great drive from any other driver on his day in the way/manner u colour this forum blue when Alonso does...just shows how much biased as a person U are.So stop blah blah,that i dislike Alonso..
Ur problem is u cant listen 1 thing against ur fav driver...even when he's wrong

Believe me i dont have the patience to keep proving to u what Alonso did was wrong,cos no matter how many links i get u...ur gonna pick certain words to prove i'm wrong...u cannot accept things which r against ur wishes...u read wht u want too..
On Doornbos statement understand the fear of a young/trying to get his grip in F1,trying to say against Alonso the current WDC & future...Its politically correct explaination for criticism for which he was made a chicken.

How many young drivers had the guts to say things abt Michael when he committed the shameful act in Monaco...& drivers who commented were politically correct answers...apart from drivers like Coulthard & JV who r seasoned & towards the end of his careers.

Oh forget it...the page looks blue anyway.

Kapel · Post by **Kapel** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 5:13 pm

On the ex drivers comment on Alonso...when did i say he's not a good driver & doesnt deserve these compliments...i give him too...what r u trying to prove here JayVee???

jacfan · Post by **jacfan** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:10 pm

Why don't you two agree to disagree and sort it all out via PM. In the meantime I am going to take shelter in the lounge with the rest of them.........

JayVee · Post by **JayVee** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:15 pm

Look Kapel, don't know why you keep avoiding the issue and going in circles

- You have a personal issue with Alonso and whatever he does you will always try to see the negative. You have proven that with the way you describe his actions and even go to the extreme of predicting that he will play dirty despite him not once playing dirty.

- The brake test incident was out of frustration from Doornbos. I do not support what he did and that he deserved punishment however to say that he did so because of his status as a World Champ is rubbish. (That is where you get personal)
Doornbos at that stage wasn't even racing for Red Bull. Would Alonso be so stupid to try and intimidate a driver that he isn't racing against.
In any case, when someone does a mistake once, they ought to be given the benefit of the doubt. With Alonso you claim that this is the start of worse things to come ???? Just because Michael did it doesn't mean Alonso will. Get it!!

- You made up the story that he crashed into Doornbos at the next race. Now show me one article that said they crashed. If you can't then have the dignity to withdraw that comment. He either crashed or didn't, it is very clear and one cannot argue against that.

- Doornbos said it was a bit of a chicken game, that means two people are having a showdown and only pride stops them from backing down. How does that make it politically correct .
I repeat I didn't see the incident but common sense Kapel tells me that had their been a crash it would have been investigated and I have read nothing about it. If you are so sure then point me to where it says they crashed.

- The quote from Hill was to show that another World Champion said that Alonso wants to win in the right way, in an honourable way (not by whatever means and that he ensures he doesn't play dirty).
And from Stewart to show that another World Champion said that Alonso is above the rest of the current field in terms of his ability. (It doesn't mean Stewart thinks the rest are crap. The same with me but you accused me of saying/thinking all other drivers are crap)

The rest, well Kapel you are just trying to make up negative things about me. I do praise other drivers when they do well and I do accept Alonso's faults when they happen.

RE30B#16 · Post by **RE30B#16** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:16 pm

Kapel wrote:When was the last time did u ever critisized ur beloved Alonso & praised Michael???i cant recollect..
I did for Michael,when he parked his car in Monaco & have praised Alonso when he deserved it.Blindfolded Alonso fans here,chose to ignore the deeds he's done this year(Like blocking slower cars & crashing into them in the next practise).

Well, Kapel, I think I have been fairly balanced in my praise or criticism of Michael Schumacher. I don't understand where all of this venom for Alonso is coming from other than Schu fans who are frustrated with how the season is going. You have never read any post from me anywhere on this forum about "Ferrari team cheating conspiracies." I have criticized MS himself for tactics unbefitting a driver of his quality. I have always given Michael Schumacher his "props."

I think you may be confusing some of my posts with other peoples' posts.

RE30B#16 · Post by **RE30B#16** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:23 pm

Kapel wrote:I would like to convey an observation on sportmanship/sportsmanspirit of the Driver who started this accusation on Michael atleast from last year & this year...Alonso is a bad loser...Never does he congratulates the winner...be it Michael or Kimi from last year..never ever will u see him waiting for the winner to congratulate him...unlike otherwise of the driver he accuses of...

You said this, Kapel. This is the statement I commented on. It is factually incorrect. There are so many pictures of Alonso congratulating his opponents after races regardless of where he finishes. He even congratulates Michael Schumacher regularly. Where do you get this 'he's is sore loser' stuff?

RE30B#16 · Post by **RE30B#16** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:29 pm

gkaytaz wrote: Hold yer fire while I make a beeline to the door.

Julian Mayo · Post by **Julian Mayo** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 9:04 pm

be vewwy vewwy quiet julian, and we may get out of here alive.................
tip toe tip toe tip toe CRASH............

...........tip toe tip toe.....................

jacfan · Post by **jacfan** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:32 pm

Julian Mayo wrote:be vewwy vewwy quiet julian, and we may get out of here alive.................
tip toe tip toe tip toe CRASH............
...........tip toe tip toe.....................

Yeah I try to get out quick if I was you...... for once you are not the target and be grateful.

cmlean · Post by **cmlean** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:41 pm

I thought I was once a target in this barrage at one time but

jacfan · Post by **jacfan** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:42 pm

I am trying not to buy into this arguement but I do have this to say....
Kapel, you really do seem to have a personal dislike (putting it mildly) of Alonso. I have never seen him resort to bad tactics. I have seen him frustrated and upset, but mainly at lack of consistancy in the penalties between different drivers and teams.
I have seen him congratulate other drivers, including Michael, when he has been beaten. You are either not watching or don't want to see.
JayVee is a totally devoted Alonso fan but to be fair I have seen her say that if he does something that is against the rules that he should be penalised the same as everyone else.
You are never going to change her mind and she is never going to influence your opinion of Alonso........ so why don't we all just take a chill pill and move on.