Takuma Sato retrograded 10 places in next GP

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jacfan
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Post by jacfan » Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:10 pm

cmlean wrote:
gkaytaz wrote:
cmlean wrote:Considering he didn't finish the race, I do find it a bit harsh.
Seems a tad harsh yes... But then rules should be applied to all drivers equally (before anyone flames; remember I said "should"). Passing under a yellow flag means a penalty. That penalty practically puts Sato in the last spot unless someone has an engine failure. Pity, I like his aggressive style :)
So if he makes it out of the sand trap, performs the drive through, everything is ok?
I thought he would be given a drive through penalty. Why give a penalty for the next race? Think I need some clarification on the rules for that. :shock:
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Post by Julian Mayo » Tue Jun 19, 2007 3:11 pm

jacfan wrote:
cmlean wrote:
gkaytaz wrote:
Seems a tad harsh yes... But then rules should be applied to all drivers equally (before anyone flames; remember I said "should"). Passing under a yellow flag means a penalty. That penalty practically puts Sato in the last spot unless someone has an engine failure. Pity, I like his aggressive style :)
So if he makes it out of the sand trap, performs the drive through, everything is ok?
I thought he would be given a drive through penalty. Why give a penalty for the next race? Think I need some clarification on the rules for that. :shock:
He was not able to acede to the penalty in this race so it carries over.
A retrograde samurai .......... :shock2:
The Mountain is a savage Mistress.

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Post by gkaytaz » Tue Jun 19, 2007 3:26 pm

cmlean wrote: So if he makes it out of the sand trap, performs the drive through, everything is ok?
I believe yes.
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Post by gkaytaz » Tue Jun 19, 2007 3:28 pm

Julian Mayo wrote:
jacfan wrote:I thought he would be given a drive through penalty. Why give a penalty for the next race? Think I need some clarification on the rules for that. :shock:
He was not able to acede to the penalty in this race so it carries over.
A retrograde samurai .......... :shock2:
Ed would be able to give you a better interpretation for sure.

Our retrograde samurai :lol: will commit seppuku :twisted:
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jacfan
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Post by jacfan » Tue Jun 19, 2007 4:25 pm

That does seem a tad harsh. I drive through would have to be a lesser penalty than dropping 10 places. I mean if he qualifies last.... where the hell does he start????
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Post by Julian Mayo » Tue Jun 19, 2007 4:32 pm

jacfan wrote:That does seem a tad harsh. I drive through would have to be a lesser penalty than dropping 10 places. I mean if he qualifies last.... where the hell does he start????
on monday :lol:
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Post by gkaytaz » Tue Jun 19, 2007 4:34 pm

jacfan wrote:That does seem a tad harsh. I drive through would have to be a lesser penalty than dropping 10 places. I mean if he qualifies last.... where the hell does he start????
Unless he manages to qualify to the top ten he'll most probably start last. Any quali spot between 12-22 means he'll start 22nd.
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Post by jacfan » Tue Jun 19, 2007 4:35 pm

gkaytaz wrote:
jacfan wrote:That does seem a tad harsh. I drive through would have to be a lesser penalty than dropping 10 places. I mean if he qualifies last.... where the hell does he start????
Unless he manages to qualify to the top ten he'll most probably start last. Any quali spot between 12-22 means he'll start 22nd.
Thanks Gkay. :wink:
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Post by gkaytaz » Tue Jun 19, 2007 4:38 pm

jacfan wrote:
gkaytaz wrote:
jacfan wrote:That does seem a tad harsh. I drive through would have to be a lesser penalty than dropping 10 places. I mean if he qualifies last.... where the hell does he start????
Unless he manages to qualify to the top ten he'll most probably start last. Any quali spot between 12-22 means he'll start 22nd.
Thanks Gkay. :wink:
Most welcome :)
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Telemetry will show all!

Post by TK9780 » Thu Jun 21, 2007 7:57 pm

Difficult this one to establish on video, :( I just hope the truth comes out when the telemetry from both cars is compared by the FIA.
But this like Fernando Alonso :shock: Safety Car refuelling penalty in Canada just shows the inflexibility of :twisted: FIA rules.

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Post by Ed » Thu Jun 21, 2007 11:29 pm

gkaytaz wrote:
Julian Mayo wrote:
jacfan wrote:I thought he would be given a drive through penalty. Why give a penalty for the next race? Think I need some clarification on the rules for that. :shock:
He was not able to acede to the penalty in this race so it carries over.
A retrograde samurai .......... :shock2:
Ed would be able to give you a better interpretation for sure.

Our retrograde samurai :lol: will commit seppuku :twisted:
The 2007 Sporting Regulations specifically mention the possibility of penalising the driver 10 grid positions at the following race as an option. It doesn't specifically highlight the case of applying this penalty if a driver retires prior to taking the penalty, however it does make sense. I suspect they will amend the rules to reflect this!

16) INCIDENTS
16.1 "Incident" means any occurrence or series of occurrences involving one or more drivers, or any action by any driver, which is reported to the stewards by the race director (or noted by the stewards and referred to the race director for investigation) which :
- necessitated the suspension of a race under Article 41 ;
- constituted a breach of these Sporting Regulations or the Code ;
- caused a false start by one or more cars ;
- caused a collision ;
- forced a driver off the track ;
- illegitimately prevented a legitimate overtaking manoeuvre by a driver ;
- illegitimately impeded another driver during overtaking.
Unless it was completely clear that a driver was in breach of any of the above, any incidents involving more than one car will normally be investigated after the race.

16.2
a) It shall be at the discretion of the stewards to decide, upon a report or request by the race director, if a driver or drivers involved in an incident shall be penalised.
b) If an incident is under investigation by the stewards a message informing all teams which driver or drivers are involved will be displayed on the timing monitors.
Provided that such a message is displayed no later than five minutes after the race has finished the driver or drivers concerned may not leave the circuit without the consent of the stewards.

16.3 The stewards may impose any one of three penalties on any driver involved in an Incident :
a) A drive-through penalty. The driver must enter the pit lane and re-join the race without stopping ;
b) A ten second time penalty. The driver must enter the pit lane, stop at his pit for at least ten seconds and then re-join the race.
c) a drop of ten grid positions at the driver’s next Event.

However, should either of the penalties under a) and b) above be imposed during the last five laps, or after the end of a race, Article 16.4b) below will not apply and 25 seconds will be added to the elapsed race time of the driver concerned.

16.4 Should the stewards decide to impose either of the penalties under Article 16.3a) or b), the following procedure will be followed :
a) The stewards will give written notification of the penalty which has been imposed to an official of the team concerned and will ensure that this information is also displayed on the timing monitors.
b) From the time the stewards’ decision is notified on the timing monitors the relevant driver may cover no more than three complete laps before entering the pit lane and, in the case of a penalty under Article 16.3b), proceeding to his garage where he shall remain for the period of the time penalty.

Of course overtaking under a yellow flag is a breach of the Sporting Code!

Yellow flag:
This is a signal of danger and should be shown to drivers in two ways with the following meanings:
- Single waved: Reduce your speed, do not overtake and be prepared to change direction. There is a hazard beside or partly on the track.
- Double waved: Reduce your speed, do not overtake and be prepared to change direction or stop. There is a hazard wholly or partly blocking the track.

Yellow flags should normally be shown only at the marshals’ post immediately preceding the hazard.
In some cases however the Clerk of the Course may order them to be shown at more than one marshals’ post preceding an incident.

Overtaking is not permitted between the first yellow flag and the green flag displayed after the incident.

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Post by gkaytaz » Thu Jun 21, 2007 11:31 pm

That's plenty. Thanks a bunch Ed.
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jacfan
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Post by jacfan » Thu Jun 21, 2007 11:33 pm

Thanks Ed. 8)
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