Tuned Mass Damper deemed illegal

Ed · Post by Ed » Thu Aug 24, 2006 7:43 am

The FIA International Court of Appeal ruled that the Tuned Mass Damper system is illegal quashing the decision made by the Stewards earlier.

A statement by the FIA read:

The FIA International Court of Appeal met in Paris on Tuesday, August 22, 2006, to examine the appeal made by the F?d?ration Internationale de l?Automobile against Decision No. 8 handed down by the Stewards of the Meeting on July 28, 2006, concerning the T car of competitor Mild Seven Renault F1 on the occasion of the Grand Prix of Germany and counting towards the 2006 FIA Formula One World Championship.

Having heard the explanations of both parties and having examined the various documents and other evidence, the Court quashed decision No. 8 of the Stewards of the Meeting and ruled that use of the device known as a Tuned Mass Damper is an infringement of Article 3.15 of the Formula One Technical Regulations.

The International Court of Appeal was presided over by Mr Philippe ROBERTI de WINGHE (Belgium), elected President, Mr Pierre TOURIGNY (Canada), Mr John CASSIDY (United States) and Mr Anthony SCRIVENER (Great Britain).

This means Renault and any other team who used the system will not be able to use it.

Julian Mayo · Post by **Julian Mayo** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 9:44 am

If these devices have been declared illegal, will we now see stripping of points, and or suspensions, as with Honda ?

rah · Post by **rah** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 9:46 am

Bloody load of bollocks. If it was illegal, Renault should not have been able to start with it. FIA should not be allowed to change rules willy nilly. They should have waited till the end of the year.

Julian Mayo · Post by **Julian Mayo** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 9:49 am

rah wrote:Bloody load of bollocks. If it was illegal, Renault should not have been able to start with it. FIA should not be allowed to change rules willy nilly. They should have waited till the end of the year.

That would require the application of intelligence by the FIA.

Ed · Post by Ed » Thu Aug 24, 2006 10:17 am

While there hasn't been an official response from Renault, prior to the hearing Renault engineering director Pat Symonds didn't think the FIA can win the case and said:

I really do not believe the FIA can win the appeal on the grounds they have said, but if they do then we really have to start to relook at the definition of what a racing car is - its suspension, everything.
If the FIA choose to interpret in the particular manner they are doing now, then there are many, many other parts on the car open to interpretation.

Julian Mayo · Post by **Julian Mayo** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 10:27 am

Hmmm......this could get rather tricky.
I still don't understand how the FIA Technical dept., can say to Renault, back in the latter part of the 2005 season,"yes it is ok to run the dampers", then do this. At the very least, it brings into doubt the expertise of the dept.

jacfan · Post by **jacfan** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 1:32 pm

Oh fruit bats!!! This is ridiculous. How they say they are ok and then change their minds. I smell a rat in the woodpile.

Julian Mayo · Post by **Julian Mayo** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 2:02 pm

jacfan wrote:Oh fruit bats!!! This is ridiculous. How they say they are ok and then change their minds. I smell a rat in the woodpile.

Ferrari conspiracy rears its ugly head once more. Head to the bar and don a flack jacket...it could get ugly.
signed,
Innocent Bystander.

jacfan · Post by **jacfan** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 2:53 pm

Julian Mayo wrote:
jacfan wrote:Oh fruit bats!!! This is ridiculous. How they say they are ok and then change their minds. I smell a rat in the woodpile.
Ferrari conspiracy rears its ugly head once more. Head to the bar and don a flack jacket...it could get ugly.
signed,
Innocent Bystander.

Was my statement that obvious? Was trying to be discreet.

Julian Mayo · Post by **Julian Mayo** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 3:18 pm

jacfan wrote:
Julian Mayo wrote:
jacfan wrote:Oh fruit bats!!! This is ridiculous. How they say they are ok and then change their minds. I smell a rat in the woodpile.
Ferrari conspiracy rears its ugly head once more. Head to the bar and don a flack jacket...it could get ugly.
signed,
Innocent Bystander.
Was my statement that obvious? Was trying to be discreet.

Might I suggest that covert ops might not be your forte

gkaytaz · Post by **gkaytaz** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 3:40 pm

Julian Mayo wrote:
jacfan wrote:
Julian Mayo wrote:
Ferrari conspiracy rears its ugly head once more. Head to the bar and don a flack jacket...it could get ugly.
signed,
Innocent Bystander.
Was my statement that obvious? Was trying to be discreet.
Might I suggest that covert ops might not be your forte

That's okay. Even I voiced that very same opinion before in some other thread and I am not siding with or against Ferrari. It's just a little unfair that some nodes of power dictate the way F1 should go...

jacfan · Post by **jacfan** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 4:26 pm

Hmmm couldn't have put it better myself. I am not against red cars (I own a red Getz) or people who drive them. The world does not revolve around red cars or certain red car drivers.

Redhead · Post by **Redhead** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 4:27 pm

The reason this has only just come up is that although the stewards have been aware of the device for a long time, it has only just come to their attention that it could influence the aerodynamics. Who it was that brought it to their attention and why they didn?t twig to it earlier is a matter for conjecture, the most commonly mentioned culprit I have heard is McLaren.

Yes there are many other moving bits on the car that influence aerodynamics, such as tyres, but there are also a lot of specific rules for those components.

Renault submitted at the hearing that the TMD only had a slight influence on the aerodynamics, and they were probably telling the truth. My understanding is that the primary function of these devices is to settle the front of the car down as it bangs over the kerbs in chicanes and tight corners. I believe the Michelins have a more flexible sidewall than the Bridgestones, and as such the oscillation as the inside tyre hits the kerb would be greater. The vertical inertia induced by these oscillations would feed through the front of the car to the outside tyre disturbing the vertical load and having a deleterious effect on grip and driveability and therefore corner exit speed, which on chicanes and slow corners leading onto long straights is critical.

If this is correct and I?m happy to be proved wrong, it would explain why it would affect the Renault more than Ferrari, but Macca?s are also on Michelins?

jacfan · Post by **jacfan** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 4:28 pm

Julian Mayo wrote:
jacfan wrote:
Julian Mayo wrote:
Ferrari conspiracy rears its ugly head once more. Head to the bar and don a flack jacket...it could get ugly.
signed,
Innocent Bystander.
Was my statement that obvious? Was trying to be discreet.
Might I suggest that covert ops might not be your forte

Darn and to think I was considering it as a new career path.....

Julian Mayo · Post by **Julian Mayo** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 4:43 pm

Redhead wrote:The reason this has only just come up is that although the stewards have been aware of the device for a long time, it has only just come to their attention that it could influence the aerodynamics. Who it was that brought it to their attention and why they didn?t twig to it earlier is a matter for conjecture, the most commonly mentioned culprit I have heard is McLaren.

Yes there are many other moving bits on the car that influence aerodynamics, such as tyres, but there are also a lot of specific rules for those components.

Renault submitted at the hearing that the TMD only had a slight influence on the aerodynamics, and they were probably telling the truth. My understanding is that the primary function of these devices is to settle the front of the car down as it bangs over the kerbs in chicanes and tight corners. I believe the Michelins have a more flexible sidewall than the Bridgestones, and as such the oscillation as the inside tyre hits the kerb would be greater. The vertical inertia induced by these oscillations would feed through the front of the car to the outside tyre disturbing the vertical load and having a deleterious effect on grip and driveability and therefore corner exit speed, which on chicanes and slow corners leading onto long straights is critical.

If this is correct and I?m happy to be proved wrong, it would explain why it would affect the Renault more than Ferrari, but Macca?s are also on Michelins?

In other words, the renault would be an understeering pig..
Mind you, fiddling with spring rates, and damper oscillation rebound rates would probably have a similar effect, without having a "slight " influence on the Aero.
What worries me is, that slight effect on the aero could translate to 50 metres advantage at the end of the next straight. Even 10 metres on each straight, lap after lap translates to some big numbers by race end
Perhaps the FIA should make this kit mandatory on all F1 cars